- cross-posted to:
- privacy@lemmy.ml
- cross-posted to:
- privacy@lemmy.ml
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Those in power hate the anonymous internet.
Ironic that this is being pushed by “liberals”. They don’t even bother to live up to their own failing ideology anymore.
Everyone in power wants it. They all say “It’s for the children”. State govs have already done it for adult sites.
WE MUST
~have age verification to~
PROTECT CHILDREN
Serious question, can we start building local infrastructure for our own internet via meshtastic and those technologies?
You should check out reticulum if you haven’t already. More use cases than just messaging.
We’re not already doing that? (No we’re not, my node is hella lonely)
The elites in every country are fighting together to keep us down, while we fight against each other.
There is a simple common problem.
I tried warning thee Canadians months ago. The assault is upon the common man. These bastards are going to enslave us and run off with a bunch of cash.
Do you want authoritarianism, because that’s how you get it.
Yes that’s whah Carney has been paid to want.
I think it’s already here (globally, I mean). The beast is just now confident to show its face.
I think they just don’t care because they know no one will do anything about it. Except protest, which is for losers.
They have been finding that pretty annoying too, they are banning as much of that as they can currently get away with even if its completely ineffective.
What can we do to stop this?
Stop voting “strategically” and stop whining about largely made-up NDP critiques. People will voluntarily eat shit just because they heard that the cake on offer doesn’t have any icing.
My plan is to just never submit to an age verification. Change servers or self host if necessary. Worse comes to worse, we log off.
And what do you do when its a requirement to buy food, submit tax returns, get healthcare?
This is the problem people don’t understand. We have the same issue now in the UK. People think a voluntary system is easy ro just ignore until everything you rely and need forces you to starve or submit.
And its not going to stop at just age verification, it’ll continue until all you get to enjoy is maybe a loaf of bread, and some pond water! 🤦♂️
I might be mistaken, but I don’t think a government can force it’s citizens to have a phone. There has to be a way to pay your taxes, buy stuff, etc that doesn’t rely on you having a phone. Paper money still exists after all.
It might be possible to live disconnected rather than giving away your privacy. You’ll have to say goodbye to social media, but I don’t see it as a bad thing.
That’s the spirit.
I’ll watch the system burn to the ground before I agree to privacy invasion.
But it won’t burn, it will be content to leave you behind.
And so what? Many of us left Reddit because it killed 3rd party apps to force us onto its shitty mobile app. Did it burn without us? No, I doubt they even noticed. Does that make our departure meaningless? Also no, we built something better here.
So it isn’t a choice between privacy invasion or watching it burn. It’s a choice between privacy invasion and being left behind.
Left behind? If you’ve deemed a system to be so necessary that refusing to abandon your privacy at its behest means you are condemned to live in obsolescence, then you’re only reinforcing the idea that we must surrender our rights for the benefits of the system.
I’m old enough to have lived in a world without the internet and if it’s going in a direction that demands I surrender my right to privacy then I’ll return to a life without the internet. I won’t be alone and just like Lemmy I’m confident we’ll build an alternative that aligns with our values.
I have serious doubts that returning to a ludite existence is truly feasible anymore. These companies, along with governments, seem intent on making it a necessity to be online and to do so without privacy.
The CEO of nvidea outright said their plans for the future involve AI agents accessing your financials and PCs being replaced with AI boxes as our interface. If they force AI into enough stuff before the bubble bursts, it won’t be a choice. The way the net works will be built for AI, not for users to manually interface with. If the infrastructure is rebuilt for AI, it won’t be a choice. With governments all pushing for OS level Id, Microsoft trying to record all user action, the push to ban VPNs, it seems like you will be making that choice sooner than you want.
I hope it works out for you but anyone who remembers a pre-internet life is middle age now and isn’t the target market for emerging tech anymore. If AI proves to be significantly advantageous, not being online to sue it will be like refusing to use computers was to the boomers. You’ll be outcompeted and lose track of how the world is changing.
The impact that may have on navigating life seems significant. Have you even considered how that would actually work? Practically.
Its unlikely that we will, too many people want this and the elites have created a system that has disempowered people completely. You work around it, with VPNs and use other sites.
Vote.
Voting won’t do shit, the majority of people don’t even see the problem with these bills.
Vous avez beau ne pas vous occuper de politique, la politique s’occupe de vous tout de même
(You might not care about politics, politics will take care of you nonetheless)
And that defeatist mentality is the reason shit doesn’t change.
For who? Where? I’m what?
Start with local elections, then move up to provincial and finally national elections. Vote the people in that won’t do this.
Take it a step further and run for election yourself.
Better parenting.
That’s not a joke. This is a stupid government’s way of trying to halt generational harm and decline due to low quality parents. Everything listed is a “if they won’t, we’ll have to” solution. Unfortunately this means every child gets a Nanny State out of it and it’ll fail to work and likely backfire long-term, leading to more nannying.
Stop buying in to the excuses the governments are using to hack at privacy and increase surveillance.
How could you possibly read that as “buying their excuses” when the context is “don’t give authoritianism excuses”? Did you make it past two words?
An authority doesn’t need much to deploy secundum quid. That’s arguably the most used tactic. It’s part of the backbone of any authoritarian ideology.
🤦
We’re so fucked, lol
Because it has nothing do to with parenting. You make a bizarre claim that there needs to be better parenting, when we both know that parenting has nothing to do with this.
You are suggesting, if I read what you said correctly that somehow they are able to get a foothold for these kinds of bills because of bad parenting. That is not true.
Almost got it.
Point is, it doesn’t have to be bad parenting, that’s just the narrative. But if not, what is it then? What’s the foothold? As far as I can tell, it’s to protect children since that’s the narrative. How was that foothold given to them? They don’t need much to work with. If it were evident there were no foothold, there wouldn’t be one.
And, you’re exactly right, they would look for another if we had this one defended well. It is evident what the end goal is, but a defence is by minimising chinks in armour. If there were strong contrasting evidence to the very few bad parents, it wouldn’t be a foothold—they couldn’t use that narrative. But they seem to think there’s just enough of a chink for pressing fallacious generalisation.
Everyone knows kids just get around it all anyway, so that’s not the point, but they’re in because there was enough to make use of secundum quid. That’s almost always how authoritarian shifts worked in social history if not outright oppression through violence. We know it’s bullshit, but it works like that, unfortunately.
How was that foothold given to them? They don’t need much to work with. If it were evident there were no foothold, there wouldn’t be one.
They don’t need one. They will simply make it up. We have seen this over and over. That is why its pointless to even have this discussion.
Because you’re trying to work around their excuse. If it’s not bad parenting, they’ll find some other absurd reason. Don’t even try to follow their nonsensical attempts to justify this invasion of privacy, that just gives them more fuel.
Why?
Because being stupid is stupid.
Good explanation…
What explanation are you even asking for? Why shouldn’t you believe fucking authoritarian propaganda? lmao??? That’s like asking why pushing over old people and laughing at them is bad; if you don’t get it, you won’t get it.
Either I grossly misinterpreted what you said originally, or a bunch of you are daft.
Explain to me how providing ID to websites is good. Explain to me how this is good for your data privacy. Uploading all your photo ID and whatnot into some private corp or government database, where it absolutely will be linked with your account, which is already grossly tracked across the internet in numerous ways. you’re just asking to have your ID attached to your online activities.
Explain to me how OPs comment about better parenting is incorrect. Kids push boundaries and things that are forbidden are enticing.
Furthermore, after you’ve attached your online profiles to your picture ID, it will be moot because there will be ways around it and the legitimate users end up being the suckers with their ID linked across the internet.
Explain to me how firewalling Canada’s internet traffic and monitoring it all is good for us.
This is all just to remove more of your anonymity, which we barely have nowadays anyways.
Parents spend less time with their children than the state and culture does. Parents all work 8-10 hours a day, they can’t feasibly solve this through parenting, not without ensuring parents have the time and resources necessary to parent. That’s also not just to partner in the right directions, but to counter the efforts of billion dollar companies and governments who are all teaching children lessons that drive them in bad directions.
Parenting is not possible in the way it was in the past. Some kind of community parenting may work, but that’s an informed concept.
You fell for their “won’t somebody think of the children?!” propaganda hook, line, and sinker. If they want suckers to let them overreach they just throw out terrorism or children as the reasons and people like you get in line instantly.
It’s not about children. It never was. It’s about getting a mandatory digital ID, where you have zero anonymity on the internet so they can keep you in line by threat of ruining your life and throwing you in jail.
Why does every government want age verification now, what’s in it for them? Can’t be one started and everyone saw it and thought that’s a great idea let’s introduce it too?
Because it de facto requires everyone using the internet to provide their identity, which is something that gives authoritarian types a huge boner. Once there is no such thing as anonymous discourse, it becomes trivial to target/arrest/harass/brutalize dissenters or indeed anyone the current regime simply doesn’t like.
It gives any gov a huge boner, not just athoritarians, that’s the real problem.
maybe they are secretly authoritarian too
This amount of surveillance has a really disturbing track record in history. So assuming any politician backing this must be a fascist at heart is the correct approach. These politicians should not be in any position to make any of these decisions. They can’t represent democracy when they declare themselves the enemies of it.
It’s part of the data center push, Palantir, all of it. Centralized info storage so if anyone starts to push back anywhere they know exactly who and where. That and ads. The internet is too anonymous.
It’s the same set of billionaires. A little line between countries doesn’t mean much to them.
It’s so blatant too, for anyone with half a brain. We’re part of 5 Eyes, there’s like 97 data centres being built or already in the late stages of approval here, and all of our internet traffic is controlled by 3 mega ISPs in moustache and glasses. We’re already being tracked pretty thoroughly. Conservatives or Liberals, it doesn’t matter when it comes to selling Canadians off to foreign corporate entities.
Because the wealthy and the elite think we are on the cusp of a world with a massive labor surplus, no jobs, and nothing to follow it. There will be massive unrest, and so they want to lockdown the internet before that happens, so it will be easier to direct the angry horde at each other rather than at the top where all the issues are actually stemming from.
Because Meta and probably Bloomberg too, bribed them.
Surveillance
Social networks see the writing on the wall and want to create regulatory capture. If they provide the identify verification it is another hook into us.
Fucking idiots everywhere
If I hear anything else about C-34 I’m going to slap the benzos out of Jordan Peterson
They are throwing Bill C-22, (L)Awful Access and C-34 at the same time to confuse low information voters.
Now here’s a camera I want full Slo-Mo 4K footage of the Benny’s hitting the floor after you slap them out of JP.
All the left wing “progressive” WEF-aligned governments falling into line with fascist, authoritarianism while their supporters hilariously call the other side fascists and Nazis 🤣
This is what “progressives” calling for censorship of opposing views leads to. I got Canadians like going to jail for criticising their government, because that’s where this leads.
In Germany, the left is among the only parties opposing stuff like this, and they have very good arguments against it! The social democrats want to “protect the kids”. The CDU is strongly in favor because they think “Teenage Terrorists” are being radicalized online.
*(sources are in German)
Unpopular opinion but I support the intent of this bill. Kids shouldn’t be exposed to algorithmic content. As it’s currently written it looks to be limited to platforms with a certain threshold of users. Which might actually encourage fediverse growth. Any slippery slop argument is silly and just benefits Zuck and friends.
Ok so ban personal recommendation algorithms for everyone. The only thing I’d settle for is an opt-in for it if it requires ID.
That would be a good option if the social networks didn’t have a long history of acting in bad faith. I think it would be an up hill battle. This seems like a reasonable response
Well, the only solution is horrific mass surveillance then.
Is that seriously your argument? If you’re on commercial social media you’re already under horrific mass surveillance. Is that you Zuck?
No, my argument is that requiring ID for the Internet is really really really fucking stupid
my argument is that requiring ID for the Internet is really really really fucking stupid
How is that argument at all related to this conversation or the bill? What are you talking about? If this bill passes you will not require ID to user the Internet in Canada. Have you read the bill?
They already have your name, phone number, age, gender and face… and are also tracking your every click and interest, every pause on scrolling, hover of your mouse, your relationships, where you were yesterday, the day before, what you buy…
Kids need parents that dont give them phones and let them browse the internet freely.
Should we require ID to buy kitchen knives too?
This will lead to one thing. Mass surveillance. Worse than it already is.
This will lead to one thing. Mass surveillance. Worse than it already is.
I’m sick of this stupid argument. If you’re on commercial social media you’re already under mass surveillance FFS 🤦♂️ And if you’re arguing that now the government will have access to this data, they already do! Social media platforms already know how old you are, they even know when you’re taking a shit. It’s just not beneficial for them to take any actions to restrict kids from using their platforms because they need the next generation of addicted users.
Kids need parents that dont give them phones and let them browse the internet freely.
Commercial social media platform are multi billion dollar companies that have built some of the most sophisticated AI/ML algorithms to get people addicted to their platforms. Do you really think the average parent has a chance here? Then consider the network affect. If most of the kids at school are socializing online on these platforms then restricting your child’s access limits their socializing. Social media access for kids needs to be limited by governments.
Should we require ID to buy kitchen knives too?
I don’t think that would be effective at reducing access for minors given knives are readily available in most kitchens.
Have you read this bill? Are you sure your opinions haven’t been manipulated by social media companies that have lobbied hard and flown influencers around to speak on their behalf?
I haven’t read the bill, and I don’t use any social media other than this. I’m not going to share too much of my personal information, but I have a feeling I may have more personal experience in some of the areas you’re referring to.
Also you mention if all the other kids have social media or phones or whatever, then some get left out - well what if people became aware/educated and the tables turned?
My opinions have not been manipulated. I despise social media. I don’t have any account except for on here. I just know where this will lead, and I’m not for it.
well what if people became aware/educated and the tables turned?
I’m basing my argument on how the world is, not how the world should be
This is about protecting kids as much as Trump was going to clean the “swamp” or release the Epstein files. I have read the bill, and it doesn’t matter what it says right now because what you read is not going to be what gets signed into law. By the time it gets on the books it will be a butchered piece of shit that will do the opposite of what it claims it will do now.
As for your claim that we should all just be happy with government mandated surveillance, well you can just go tell your 3 letter agency overlords that I am not interested. My options to avoid mass surveillance and having my every word and move tracked may be diminishing at an alarming rate, but I am not going to accelerate it’s deterioration just because you are a Steve Job fuckboy who puts down your high score in flappy birds under “computer experience” on your resume.As for your claim that we should all just be happy with government mandated surveillance
I never made that claim. What the hell are you talking about?! Your whole comment is just the rambles of a mad man
Welcome to Lemmy!
